Comments on: Microsoft goes Live with search, gets sexier, drops extraneous Windows http://www.makeyougohmm.com/20060912/3774/ Technology, music, video, art, news, reviews and muse on the web Fri, 05 Dec 2008 00:53:55 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.2 By: Toby Getsch http://www.makeyougohmm.com/20060912/3774/#comment-314736 Toby Getsch Thu, 28 Sep 2006 13:41:59 +0000 http://www.makeyougohmm.com/20060912/3774/#comment-314736 That's a great list of descriptions. I agree with all of them. Now, when a company has a beta, if you could just get them all to use those terms and to clearly mark where the product is in that spectrum, and also to let me know where I am in that spectrum if I'm already signed in (Passport.net, etc.). That's the problem. It's not our definitions. It's a lack of standards and implementations of those standards that make it super-confusing for any average user. I'd bet that most people don't even know if they are using beta products or not. Reading EULA's is so 1998! BTW, I'm still really annoyed that "they" took away "no pagination" from Live.com. I so want it back! It's well past any sort of one week, new software test. ;) I just want it back. (TDavid, I'm not ranting to you, just on your post and about this conversation....) That’s a great list of descriptions. I agree with all of them.

Now, when a company has a beta, if you could just get them all to use those terms and to clearly mark where the product is in that spectrum, and also to let me know where I am in that spectrum if I’m already signed in (Passport.net, etc.). That’s the problem. It’s not our definitions. It’s a lack of standards and implementations of those standards that make it super-confusing for any average user. I’d bet that most people don’t even know if they are using beta products or not. Reading EULA’s is so 1998!

BTW, I’m still really annoyed that “they” took away “no pagination” from Live.com. I so want it back! It’s well past any sort of one week, new software test. ;) I just want it back. (TDavid, I’m not ranting to you, just on your post and about this conversation….)

]]> By: TDavid http://www.makeyougohmm.com/20060912/3774/#comment-299689 TDavid Tue, 12 Sep 2006 19:13:25 +0000 http://www.makeyougohmm.com/20060912/3774/#comment-299689 Though these aren't official descriptions, Toby, this is how I tend to define them: <b>public beta</b> - anybody can automatically sign up, download and try the software. There's nothing wrong with these betas (unless they start charging for them). Some companies release new products and never leave beta. Perpetual beta. I like to review products/services/websites in this stage because readers can then try out themselves and be their own judge. <b>internal beta</b> - only beta testing by the company and its employees and perhaps family of employees <b>private beta</b> - select people are invited and this may or may not include a NDA prohibiting discussion about the beta, can be at a very early stage of a product's life cycle. <b>invite-only beta</b> - select people are invited and given an allotment of invites to invite other friends. Companies say this is a way for them to scale to the users, but it seems more like a cheap scheme to get people to want it more because it's not open to the masses like a public beta. Hope that helps :) Though these aren’t official descriptions, Toby, this is how I tend to define them:

public beta - anybody can automatically sign up, download and try the software. There’s nothing wrong with these betas (unless they start charging for them). Some companies release new products and never leave beta. Perpetual beta. I like to review products/services/websites in this stage because readers can then try out themselves and be their own judge.
internal beta - only beta testing by the company and its employees and perhaps family of employees
private beta - select people are invited and this may or may not include a NDA prohibiting discussion about the beta, can be at a very early stage of a product’s life cycle.
invite-only beta - select people are invited and given an allotment of invites to invite other friends. Companies say this is a way for them to scale to the users, but it seems more like a cheap scheme to get people to want it more because it’s not open to the masses like a public beta.

Hope that helps :)

]]> By: Toby Getsch http://www.makeyougohmm.com/20060912/3774/#comment-299676 Toby Getsch Tue, 12 Sep 2006 18:32:51 +0000 http://www.makeyougohmm.com/20060912/3774/#comment-299676 BTW, not knowing what is a public beta or a private beta or an invitation only beta... That's a silly demonstration of a product and a silly way to get the word out and get public buy-in. Yeah, they have a lot of work to do. A lot. BTW, not knowing what is a public beta or a private beta or an invitation only beta… That’s a silly demonstration of a product and a silly way to get the word out and get public buy-in. Yeah, they have a lot of work to do. A lot.

]]> By: Toby Getsch http://www.makeyougohmm.com/20060912/3774/#comment-299659 Toby Getsch Tue, 12 Sep 2006 17:10:12 +0000 http://www.makeyougohmm.com/20060912/3774/#comment-299659 I'm pretty sure that any of the betas listed from the ideas.live site are public beta. If not, at the least you can follow those links and then get those blogs to learn more about them. I’m pretty sure that any of the betas listed from the ideas.live site are public beta. If not, at the least you can follow those links and then get those blogs to learn more about them.

]]> By: TDavid http://www.makeyougohmm.com/20060912/3774/#comment-299658 TDavid Tue, 12 Sep 2006 16:56:02 +0000 http://www.makeyougohmm.com/20060912/3774/#comment-299658 Toby - thanks for linking the feedback list, I wasn't aware of that one (ideas live is linked above to some of the products, so knew about that one), but some of those in that list don't appear to be in public beta, yes/no? My list wasn't intended to be all inclusive but to include only those Live services that were in public beta, meaning anybody could sign up for and start using them today. There are Live services that aren't listed on the feedback list nor mine that I've personally seen up at Redmond (NDA prevents me from saying anything further). The Live list is going to be long. Toby - thanks for linking the feedback list, I wasn’t aware of that one (ideas live is linked above to some of the products, so knew about that one), but some of those in that list don’t appear to be in public beta, yes/no? My list wasn’t intended to be all inclusive but to include only those Live services that were in public beta, meaning anybody could sign up for and start using them today.

There are Live services that aren’t listed on the feedback list nor mine that I’ve personally seen up at Redmond (NDA prevents me from saying anything further). The Live list is going to be long.

]]> By: Toby Getsch http://www.makeyougohmm.com/20060912/3774/#comment-299653 Toby Getsch Tue, 12 Sep 2006 16:37:22 +0000 http://www.makeyougohmm.com/20060912/3774/#comment-299653 You missed a few of the Live beta things. See http://ideas.live.com for a more complete list. Currently there is a list of betas down the left side. Also see http://feedback.live.com for a complete list of all Live services, all in one place. FWIW, I love the Live stuff, but the marketing is gutter-rot! Their branding is grade-school at best. No. Their branding is grad-school and highly educated, when it should be grade school and catchy! And their naming is sludge in the bottom of a septic tank. They have *lots* of work to do to come across cleaner and simpler to the masses. Most non-technical thinking people are just confused. That's their target, but for some reason, they're just lost. I think they know where they are, just not where they are going. It's just a garbled mess. And, that's coming from a big fan! Live OneNote would be cool. I wonder what it would look like. You missed a few of the Live beta things. See http://ideas.live.com for a more complete list. Currently there is a list of betas down the left side. Also see http://feedback.live.com for a complete list of all Live services, all in one place.

FWIW, I love the Live stuff, but the marketing is gutter-rot! Their branding is grade-school at best. No. Their branding is grad-school and highly educated, when it should be grade school and catchy! And their naming is sludge in the bottom of a septic tank. They have *lots* of work to do to come across cleaner and simpler to the masses. Most non-technical thinking people are just confused. That’s their target, but for some reason, they’re just lost. I think they know where they are, just not where they are going. It’s just a garbled mess. And, that’s coming from a big fan!

Live OneNote would be cool. I wonder what it would look like.

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